This isn't just a "Duh!"...

[averygoodun42]

It's a "WELL, NO SHIT!!!"

Anyone with an active brain can work that out. Why do you think the American car makers are in such trouble? Because they CAN'T AFFORD THE HEALTHCARE! And do NOT put the fucking blame on the unions for wanting such a luxury.


However, I am losing hope that real healthcare reform will happen. The thousands of jobs that the insurance companies have are worth more than the millions of jobs of the whole country.

That and the scary concept of socialism (woooooooo).

I am so fucking tired of the selfishness of this country's attitude (and not just on this issue). But then, what should I expect from a country founded on Persecution and Slavery.

'Cause that's what it boils down to, ya know.


If we really want to prove that this is a country where every man (grr) is equal, then let us at least TRY for economic equality, too.

No, I'm not saying every person should be paid the same or limit how much a person can make on the upward scale (or have the government run everything, because that would be scary). That would be as stupid as our current system of greed and corporate (feudal) lords.

I'm saying let's move above the whole slavery concept and give the workers some of the fucking rights they deserve (and supposedly have)!

Comments

[zalena.livejournal.com]

Don't be silly. Universal healthcare would probably involve an even LARGER bureaucracy than insurance companies, especially since twice as many people would be insured. It would create jobs!

This is totally tangential, but I thought you might appreciate the following from Terry Jones' Medieval Life series. It really opened my eyes about the condition of the peasant. He says that it was actually enclosure laws and the industrial revolution that took away the power of the peasant:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2606384069727787131

Anyway, I recommend the whole series, but this was one of my favorites, along with The Monk. And they are all available for FREE online.

[droxy.livejournal.com]

Whatever is implemented it must be teh same for all, politicians cannot have a different plan, nor amend special rights to the plan for themselves.

That's a study by the current admin, have you read the studies what the other side has to say? It's important.

Most of all it needs to be simple, and spelled out clearly what services are cut off at what age limits. Also a "time to service" meaning Iwant a promise on the level of quality and timelness of service...e.g. if you have cancer does teh govt make you wait until it's terminal and then shrug, becasue they have control or simply force those to pay out of pocket for treatment. So many details so little answers.

Those are not socialist questions, they are about quality of service (wait times and availability) choice and care and cost.

I dont beleive the govt can be more efficient unless I see it from both sides. Recent and public exposure of shoddy service at the VA will tell you how good the govt is at providing service. If they treat the miliraty vetereans this bad, imagine the citizens. Not a issue on socialism, but the ability to do a job the govt isn't designed to do.

[averygoodun.livejournal.com]

Agreed. Abso-fucking-lutely agreed with your first point. If they want more, they have to pay for it out of their own pocket, just like everyone else.

I've read a bit of what the other side says, and while some of it makes sense, other bits are complete bullshit made up by the lobbies who rule the medical care in this country.

Again, I agree completely though with the proviso that the caregivers (doctors, nurses and such) are consulted when making the rules. But perhaps you are thinking of nationalized care versus socialized? I don't want the gov running the care facilities, I want the gov paying for the people's care and, well, governing (enforcing the common sense rules to make sure the care, availability and cost are all reasonable).

As for the VA... for the most part, it is run quite well. There are guidelines they have to follow to keep costs down, but for the most part, the guidelines follow cover all that anyone needs. As for cost, they operate at 60 cents to the dollar. I'd say that's pretty efficient.

There's a LOT of anti-reform propaganda out there. The insurance, drug and medical lobbies are very, very powerful and very, very wealthy. Be careful what you believe.

[droxy.livejournal.com]

Well, govt (and especially politicans) runs on money. Like or not, right or wrong, it is how the world works. I cant change it, you cant change it- we dont have teh money. it's called buying time and influence. No one, except charities perhaps (excluding the united way-who are crooks), are altruistic. Expecting politians to do common sense things for the right reasons is day dreaming. The govt has not proved itself to me (based on long past to current behavior) it is capabable of doing such behavior- by govt I mean the individual politicians (who are all very wealthy individuals in their own rights)..

What will happen is a there will be a plan that no one is happy with, even the "consumers" and the "wealthy corps". I just wish the govt would stick to it's powers of the consitiution and get out of managing people lives and choices. That means choices that don't win, e.g. people have the right to make mistakes. I dont care for parental government.

For example, where was the govt in it's company saving mode (e.g. GM) when many companies I worked for failed. I got the boot. There is no altruism. There is another agenda, there is nothing making GM more special than telecommunications. GM should have been left to fail. Just like alot of businesses in this downturn.

The VA was doing things considered really bad and the reports are squick. Yes people make mistakes, but damn, over a period of years... we are talking HIV. Where are the folks who know basic sanitation procedures, why were they not employed...that's scary.

I'd rather see a nationalied wellness program than HC reform. That would make more sense.

I'd rather see the govt work on tax reform to make outsourcing less desirable and provide incentives for keeping jobs here, especially with the unemployment issues.

[bluzkat.livejournal.com]

I'm with you. I dispair that we won't get there. Too many interests against it - insurance companies, big pharm, doctors, lawyers and the paranoid who think equal access to health care means socialism or communism.

When I was younger, I was absolutely against universal health care. I didn't want the government running something so important. And at the time, we lead the world in the quality of health care and advancements in research. Now, we have the most expensive system in the world and are somewhere around 43rd in quality for dollar spent.

It boggles my mind that we have people in this country who don't have access to adequate health care, that some people have to decide which medicines they can do without that month because they can't afford them, that others have to decide whether to eat this month or take meds.

And I'm with you about heartlessness. I've heard people that i once respected talk about how they resent paying they way for someone else, implying that people who don't have health care are just lazy good for nothings. grrrr! When did we become a nation of ME, ME, ME?

To those who say, "It's too expensive." I have to ask; why do we always find money for other things, but when it comes to health care, we just throw up our hands and say it's too expensive? We can spent billions in Iraq and Afghanistan, but we can't find the millions for the health of our own people? GAH!

I could rant for hours about this. I don't know what the answer is, but we need keep trying. (I feel a bit passionate about this. Can you tell?)

[bluzkat.livejournal.com]

despair*

I guess if I'm going to rant, I should take time to spell check.

[droxy.livejournal.com]

These are some good basic compare for nat’l health insurance.
http://www.balancedpolitics.org/universal_health_care.htm
http://blog.heritage.org/2009/03/25/10-surprising-facts-about-american-health-care
This is amazing!
http://www.balancedpolitics.org/editorial-solution_to_health_care_crisis.htm
Interesting….
http://townhall.com/columnists/WalterEWilliams/2004/07/21/free_health_care
to balance that..
http://www.yesmagazine.org/article.asp?ID=1503
So who is right?

Then this-
http://www.getbetterhealth.com/whats-wrong-with-canadas-healthcare-system/2009.03.13
But there is this..
http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/francis/archive/2009/05/12/health-care-lies-about-canda.aspx

This one is all over the place, but read the comments.
http://hotair.com/archives/2009/05/27/video-canadian-warns-americans-about-health-care-reform/

None of these articles really discusses socialism..